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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2021 14:00:48 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2021 14:01:09 GMT -5
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Post by vincent on May 29, 2021 14:35:56 GMT -5
Uh ?
No introduction ? no question ? no source ? Nothing ?
Really ?
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2021 16:02:05 GMT -5
It's a pitch. I had a get-together the same minute I was finishing the thread. I'd have to go around mines and conflicts, so it's better I say less than more.
Either way, as a PITCH, I see it as highly plausible this would be just about the process of the four domains, with S being the "outer-most sphere" and T being the "inner-most sphere" in terms of progressing from external impulses to an individual's processing of them.
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anthony
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Post by anthony on May 29, 2021 16:04:28 GMT -5
How does this apply to CT types as we understand them? And why is F before T in the flow?
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2021 16:09:21 GMT -5
How does this apply to CT types as we understand them? And why is F before T in the flow? In practice, these patterns are broken far more, but in abstractions, we first define ends and then we define means. Of course fuck-y Fx (PoLR) can try to invert the process and first define means, trying to make them universal, and then try to BS them at anything to pretend they have ends, but for the most part and separate of part just as the platonic train of thought, we first must realize we are real and perceive the swath of impressions the world has, then we need to interpret them in a conceptual language we understand and make meaning of, then we need to take that and see what goals we need (usually the assumption is survival, and the goal is structuring a value-structure, or priority structure, towards that) and then we need to find a way to realize that goal. This way we can keep getting out of trouble and avoiding death. In specific types, there is a specific flow of development and neglect that affects this train, especially in subtypes, which neglect rows.
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ahmed
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Post by ahmed on May 29, 2021 18:54:52 GMT -5
Either way, as a PITCH, I see it as highly plausible this would be just about the process of the four domains, with S being the "outer-most sphere" and T being the "inner-most sphere" in terms of progressing from external impulses to an individual's processing of them. If this is the case then N should come last, because interpretation to a conceptual language needs a kick from a different process (J, or generally in any case a barzakh/an isthmus is always needed) that forms some sort of a system. and the ideal is an end goal to any sort of structure. wouldn't that paradoxically makes it the beginning though? why not go in the other direction? and wouldn't i/e have a more important role when it comes to that sort of division? Because either Ji could be evaluate and either Je could be resolve. and record in this context seems closer to Si than it would to Se.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2021 19:27:06 GMT -5
Either way, as a PITCH, I see it as highly plausible this would be just about the process of the four domains, with S being the "outer-most sphere" and T being the "inner-most sphere" in terms of progressing from external impulses to an individual's processing of them. If this is the case then N should come last, because interpretation to a conceptual language needs a kick from a different process (J, or generally in any case a barzakh/an isthmus is always needed) that forms some sort of a system. and the ideal is an end goal to any sort of structure. wouldn't that paradoxically makes it the beginning though? why not go in the other direction? and wouldn't i/e have a more important role when it comes to that sort of division? Because either Ji could be evaluate and either Je could be resolve. and record in this context seems closer to Si than it would to Se. I mean, the world is itself a sort of function. We can picture the world, and especially as one perceives it, as the knots between this thought-machine and actual reality. You have a sort of mirror of reality in your head that if you affect will affect reality itself, whereas reality itself affects this web. This web is what you perceive as real, concrete reality. However, in spite of this fact, the world still mostly functions as it pokes you, you poke it, it pokes you in response, you poke it back, and so on ad infinity. It's a loop.
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Post by Deleted on May 29, 2021 19:31:39 GMT -5
Either way, as a PITCH, I see it as highly plausible this would be just about the process of the four domains, with S being the "outer-most sphere" and T being the "inner-most sphere" in terms of progressing from external impulses to an individual's processing of them. If this is the case then N should come last, because interpretation to a conceptual language needs a kick from a different process (J, or generally in any case a barzakh/an isthmus is always needed) that forms some sort of a system. and the ideal is an end goal to any sort of structure. wouldn't that paradoxically makes it the beginning though? why not go in the other direction? and wouldn't i/e have a more important role when it comes to that sort of division? Because either Ji could be evaluate and either Je could be resolve. and record in this context seems closer to Si than it would to Se. Also, in the context of Se > Si for recording, the Se recording is sort of stirring the pot to broaden the field of perception. Si records "as is", but it also has a sort of stubborness about the channels it receives input on. Se sort of dissolves this, and recreates/reorganizes channels of input. Imagine people on psychedelics and children. As they rub sand on all over their body and rediscover basic perceptions. "woah dude I didn't know I had this 'sense' " I mean Se itself is sort of sensual, impressionistic, twisting. Imagining a shaman, I'd imagine the Se as the play that mesmerizes you in indulgence of senses. EDIT: changed order of words to avoid using drugged up children as an example
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ahmed
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Post by ahmed on May 29, 2021 20:58:28 GMT -5
However, in spite of this fact, the world still mostly functions as it pokes you, you poke it, it pokes you in response, you poke it back, and so on ad infinity. It's a loop. Right, precisely it is a loop. Just as the axes are loops, so to say one starts and the other follows is highly dependent upon the frame you use and can be any other orderđź‘€
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2021 5:45:38 GMT -5
However, in spite of this fact, the world still mostly functions as it pokes you, you poke it, it pokes you in response, you poke it back, and so on ad infinity. It's a loop. Right, precisely it is a loop. Just as the axes are loops, so to say one starts and the other follows is highly dependent upon the frame you use and can be any other order👀 No, it can't, not in a way that the world is at the beginning and end of the four domains. The world is a key part of the loop that isn't a part of the domains. You can push the start of the loop to something else than S, or you can put something else than T. By the way of the retained order of following each other, both of these cases are essentially the same case. And that case is one where there is a "world-gap" in domains such as [N]=>[F]=>[T]=>["world gap" | senses/muscles]=>[S‍‍]=>[N]=>... Which is a possible way to depict it, but it fragments the process up.
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Post by Roshan on May 30, 2021 8:57:19 GMT -5
Attributing 'details' and 'analysis' to Se over all other functions but one is really sloppy. And that's what the schema does as shown. Attempting to justify it by explaining it would be like putting adhesive tape on a structurally unsound building. It needs to be changed.
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Post by Deleted on May 30, 2021 11:53:21 GMT -5
Attributing 'details' and 'analysis' to Se over all other functions but one is really sloppy. And that's what the schema does as shown. Attempting to justify it by explaining it would be like putting adhesive tape on a structurally unsound building. It needs to be changed. I can agree that details and analysis are a bit too broad, but it's a lack of refinement and finding the nearest word to the meaning, as opposed to being intrinsically flawed. What I was trying to characterize was the fact that to record new EXTERNAL information, either from the consistent channel(Si), or from the sensory qualia-soup(Se), you need S.
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Post by Roshan on May 30, 2021 12:13:42 GMT -5
(ugh, didn't copy )
I get more or less what you're pointing to. But since Se qua Se (in as much as anything can qua in this system) is (most) UNmediated metabolism of the phenomenal world, it's one of the, if not the, least detailed and least analytical of all the functions. As you know, whence 'soup'. So it can't just 'have' details and and analysis. So fix the terminology or the graphic or both. Maybe you need colors? arrows? more text? some reorganization? a different shape? I have a feeling you can do it faster and better than I can learn enough of what Russell's logical atomism is to make enough of a dent to fill a nanoparticle of even one of the holes in my head.
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Post by vincent on May 30, 2021 12:26:57 GMT -5
Attributing 'details' and 'analysis' to Se over all other functions but one is really sloppy. And that's what the schema does as shown. Attempting to justify it by explaining it would be like putting adhesive tape on a structurally unsound building. It needs to be changed.
Yes, i absolutely agree.
Another thing, that might not be completely unrelated, is that attributing "motoric sequences" "know-how" and "tactics" to T makes it heavily biased toward Te. Imo.
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